Pam Zekman is at it again.
This time the CBS 2 investigative reporter has ticket writing Traffic Aide Debra Taylor in her sights.
Does Taylor’s name sound familiar? It should.
Because it’s the same Debra Taylor who was spotlighted last week in a Sun-Times article where Taylor allegedly parked illegally before she began her job of writing parking tickets.
This time, Taylor is being accused of writing bogus parking tickets all over the south loop, ranging from street cleaning tickets after October 31st when street cleaning officially ends, to parking 20 feet from a cross walk despite no signs being posted.
Read Zekman’s full story here or you can check out the video report here.
Photo courtesy and copyright CBS 2 News.
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About time they expose their bad tickets. Its not just her, its a bunch of them. That’s what happens when they make them enforce without properly knowing their ordinance.
Other tickets they write:
-No parking 6am to 6pm in the loop; they enforce outside the designated streets.
-Expired meter: outside designated metered areas
-Expired meters ( on handicapped vehicles )
I honestly believe the Traffic Aide thinks she is enforcing correctly. They know everything of course.
If Pam Zekman knocked on my door, I’d say I wasn’t at home either.
Why does everyone think that street cleaning season ended Oct 31?
There are permanent signs posted all over Chicago…some even have a Nov 30 end date.
Department of Revenue PEA’s were instructed to No longer enforce this year on Nov 20th.
Now…I will agree with the Outside Metered Space tickets. And I am unsure what TMA policy is for HCP marked vehicles that have an Expired Pay & Display receipt. I would remind though…HCP plates and placards are only supposed to be used when the OWNER of the Plate/Placard is a passenger in that vehicle.
I know that area…but do not recall if those signs State that the restriction is for street cleaning or just a generic No Park for that time frame and etc.
Street Cleaning signs are still going up around the city…..the temp multi-colored ones. As of Nov 21st…only CPD and Streets & Sanitation can issue for them
One of the violations mentioned by that award winning journalist was Park/Stand within 20 feet of a Crosswalk (when signs are present).
What does that mean?
It means that if there is a Yellow Crosswalk Sign (WITH Arrow pointing down AT the crosswalk) By the crosswalk….you have to give the 20 foot clearance.
Otherwise we can ticket you.
Now…what the person doesn’t say…is what type of Vehicle they own and park there.
If the vehicle is 6 Feet Tall or Taller, It is NOT allowed to park within 20 feet of a crosswalk REGARDLESS of Signage being Present or NOT.
If traffic aides and other parking enforcement personnel can’t keep all these arcane rules/restrictions straight, how do they expect the motoring public to?
Oh, that’s right, they don’t. We’re talking about generating revenue . . . not ensuring public safety.
DoR said:
“Why does everyone think that street cleaning season ended Oct 31?”
I don’t know, maybe because the sign said Oct 31?
Did you even watch the video?
Man, I hate to ride your butt all the time, but what am I supposed to think? In the video, the sign clearly and exactly said, “STREET CLEANING No Parking 7am-9am Tuesdays April 1 – Oct 31 TOW ZONE”
The report mentioned the crosswalk thing, and there were clearly no signs, so why do you point out that if there is a sign, we can get ticketed? OF COURSE WE CAN GET TICKETED IT THERE’S A SIGN, THAT’S THE WHOLE PROBLEM, THERE’S NO SIGN!
Why are you so hell-bent on defending PEAs, or whoever? Why can’t you at least agree that these are bogus tickets?
Man, you wear me out.
Well said, Lance, well said.
JA,
I will agree with you. The street cleaning tickets are clearly bogus. The signs are perfectly clear. The only way tickets could be written for street cleaning AFTER October 31st would be for Streets and Sanitations to properly post the multi-colored sign for the appropiate day.
Lance,
You are right, it does get confusing from time to time. We try our best, but mistakes do happen.
DoR,
Sorry to correct you on the board, but I would suggest you re-read the ordinance in regards to the 20ft from crosswalk. 9-64-100(f) Within 20 feet of a crosswalk where official signs are posted; That means there has to be a sign.
Lance Uppercut Said:
“If traffic aides and other parking enforcement personnel can’t keep all these arcane rules/restrictions straight, how do they expect the motoring public to?”
Your statement is proving true right on this board – DOR and Ticketmaster are even disagreeing as to what the laws are…
Um TM………thats what I said.
To quote myself:
“It means that if there is a Yellow Crosswalk Sign (WITH Arrow pointing down AT the crosswalk) By the crosswalk….you have to give the 20 foot clearance.
Otherwise we can ticket you.”
And John…..I am not…nor did I state previously that the tickets were correct. I commented that I didn’t remember what they said on the signs and left it at that.
However;
I asked the query as to Why does everyone think ALL Street Cleaning Ended on Oct 31st, when it didn’t.
Even the vaunted Ticketmaster does not correct me on that point.
DoR,
maybe I did mis-read your post. I will take another look, after all even the “vaunted Ticketmaster” can make a mistake.
Gregg,
The reason why we can disagree is because how the rules and regulations were explained when I was trained could be completely different than the way DoR was trained. I am embarrased to say, when I was a rookie, we were told 20ft from the crosswalk was violation that we could write. All we had to do was make sure it was 20ft. It was NEVER explained that a sign was needed. Two years and lord knows how many 20ft from the crosswalk tickets issued later, peas were informed that the signs were needed.
I also must point out, that orders issued at one site/shift, may not be relayed to other sites/shifts. Therefore that can and does create some conflicting issues.
We do the best that we can. Mistakes can and will happen. Do we regret them? YES Do we try to limit them? Yes More importantly, do we learn from them? That answer is also YES
Ticketmaster -
You just supported the point I was making.
It doesn’t matter why there are different interpretations or how far up the ladder it goes..
It still boils down to the fact that if different city personel see the laws differently – for whatever reasons – how is the average Joe citizen suppose to understand the laws?
doest it…..realy matter???……that is…..a…….pimp ticket…….we can…..stop…writing it…….and stil…..make lots and……lots…..of…..money……john n jane….q…..public…….will….break the….law….anyways………besides…..people….cant….read…..signs……anyways…….
Greg-
Sometimes its just common sense not to do things. If people want to know laws of Chicago, they can look it up and see all the ordinances. If they are worried about street cleaning, they can look up when they street clean on their block. If you do not know that you can not park withing 30ft of a stop sign; you can simply receive a ticket for violating this or simply learn from this and study Chicago and Illinois Ordinances.
Hey everyone,
It is VERY interesting we’re discussing the 20 foot crosswalk rule.
It is this particular violation that opened up my eyes to the muni-code and influenced me to start fighting all my tickets.
I went into fight this ticket and the hearing officer, looked at the code and dismissed it right away. I forgot all the details, but she explained to me there had to be a sign there for the muni-code to apply.
It was at that point I realized I needed to start giving the muni-code a hard look and to arm myself with the knowledge of parking law.
Often, the keys to victory are in the muni-code.
The funny thing is, a year or so later, I get ticketed for the same violation. I go to fight it and explain to the hearing officer (not a very informed one) that there was no sign compelling me to park 20 feet from the crosswalk.
He tells me it doesn’t matter. I say, no, it’s in the muni-code and since he has a copy on his desk, he may want to look it up.
So he does. It takes about 5 minutes and this guy starts to seeth and turn red in the face because some smart ass (me) knows more about the muni-code than he does.
Ultimately, he has to dismiss it but he sure wasn’t happy about it or with me.
The lesson is, always read the applicable muni code to see where the loopholes are–if they exist at all. It’s worth the time.
NEVER assume the hearing officer knows the law. Many, if not most, know their stuff. There are a handful who do not and routinely make mistakes.
I live in the neighborhood in question that this report profiled, and I can tell you unequivocally that we are not getting fair treatment as far as ticket writing is concerned. The TMA agent in question deserves to be slapped on the wrist for her abusive tactics beyond a shadow of a doubt. There are no yellow crosswalk signs at that intersection, much less ‘no parking’ signs….no yellow curb….nothing. For 20 years there has been nothing!!! There have been no tickets until this year at that particular spot. In Dearborn Park we have permanent street cleaning signs…..PERMANENT!! All one has to do is read the sign and write the ticket if it falls within the posted dates and times on the PERMANENT signs!! For Christ’s sake…there’s no reason to even debate such. Street cleaning has never been an issue….never!! But it doesn’t end there….. We have residents getting tickets for window tint, lack of temporary residential parking permits (even when they actually have one clearly posted), obscured license plates (because of nothing more than dirt…yes dirt!!), being 1 foot in the crosswalk (1 foot…gimme a break), blocking driveways (when it’s absolutely not the case). I have not seen such abuse in my life!!! It’s a hassle to park in my own neighborhood at times, and I pay every year for a residential permit. Of course that permit does not always guarantee me a spot on my own street, but whatever. To have some inconsiderate city worker with a fricken power trip attitude make my day miserable by slapping a BS ticket on my windshield just makes one want to scream. What has become of this city??
Optimus -
This still has nothing to do with the fact that different reps from the city seem to be at odds about what the laws are.
Maybe THEY are the ones who should be looking up the laws.
As PTG just showed, some of those who are counted on to apply the laws in hearings don’t even know what they are.
Lady PEA -
That is simply not true. I read them ALL the time. As do thousands of people.
As was stated earlier, please don’t dump all drivers into one “all drivers are stupid” category.
And yes – it does matter. Even if it is a “pimp” ticket, people still have to go thru the hassle of appealing the ticket that blatantly shouldn’t have been written in the first place.
DoR said:
“And John…..I am not…nor did I state previously that the tickets were correct. I commented that I didn’t remember what they said on the signs and left it at that.”
You didn’t have to remember anything…it was very clear on the video. And you said this after asking “why does everyone think that Street Cleaning ended Oct 31?”
If you agree that the tickets are bogus, or the PEA is a renegade, why not clearly come out and say it?
From the way you phrase things, sometimes it’s hard to know your stance on the topic, but more often than not it comes off as if you think all us Chicago motorists are a bunch of morons who don’t give a flip about the law, safety, or anyone besides our own selves. And THAT is just not true.
As Greg said, we read the signs ALL the time. I scour the area for signs, I look ALL OVER the place to make dang sure I am parked legally, because I can’t afford a ticket, nor can I afford the time to fight one.
The bottom line is:
WHAT ARE WE, THE CITIZENS OF THIS CITY, GOING TO DO ABOUT THIS CRAP?
WHO WILL RUN AGAINST DALEY?
WHO WILL RUN AGAINST THE INCUMBENT ALDERMAN?
OUR CITY IS A MESS, AND IT’S UP TO US TO CLEAN IT UP.
SouthLoop,
I’m sure sorry about the crap you are enduring right now. Hopefully it stops NOW.
And although you have it especially bad down there for some reason, there are many other instances of this kind of bogus ticket writing all over the city.
All I know is, unless we all do something, it won’t stop.
stop……it will……never……stop……so long……as…….people……continue to……ignore the signs……fail to by the……needed stickers…….and the….powers that…….be.keep…..pressuring us……to get more …….and more
ldypea, I’m talking about changing the laws and the changing the officials. This goes way beyond whether or not we read signs.
We are going to replace those “powers that be” with new blood, put people in office that won’t sell us out, and continue to write to our aldermen and complain about all this unjustice.
We need to get off our butts and quit waiting for Pam Zekman to do all the work.
What would it take to get some kind of class action lawsuit going? Is there someone else in higher authority at the State level that we can start appealing to?
I feel like we are in a police state with a dictator running his own little country here, with no recourse. It’s driving me crazy.
And ldypea, would you be willing to testify that you are being pressured to bring in more tickets?
I mean, does anybody else think it’s crazy that they are pressured to bring it tickets? What if Chicago Cops were pressured to bring in more “criminals”? What if the Fire Dept was pressured to “put out more fires”? Real soon we’d have bogus arrests, and a curious rise in the number of buildings that suddenly caught fire.
DOR stated in earlier posts that the city should imprison citizens for not paying their parking tickets. That’s a great idea now that I think about it. It should be a double edge sword. Any improperly written ticket should then imprison the ticket writer. Fair is fair.
I hear what you’re saying, South Loop, but tinted windows and parking IN/ON a crosswalk (as you mentioned) are clear violations.
Is ldypea Uniblab in disguise?
“Spacely…is…a…stoop!”
“Spacely…is…a…stoop!”
Anyone seen the movie “Grandma’s Boy”? There’s a character who talks like a robot whenever he gets nervous . . . ldypea’s posts remind me of that every time.
Or an old-fashioned stock market ticker ….. Amalgamated Collar Buttons ….. Down 3.17 ….. Consolidated Whale Oil ….. Up 5.32 ….. United Mustache Wax …. Down .84 …..
ldypea said:
“stop……it will……never……stop……so long……as…….people……continue to……ignore the signs……fail to by the……needed stickers…….and the….powers that…….be.keep…..pressuring us……to get more …….and more”
See – here again is evidence to the contrary of the often stated mantra on this board that there is no quota for tickets.
While there may not be a specific number required of each ticket writer, isn’t the fact that there is pressure to write more tickets in essence a quota? Perhaps that is why this writer in the South Loop is writing bogus tickets – she is being pressured to write more than she is already able to legally writing, so she has to write bad tickets.
John Adams Said:
“As Greg said, we read the signs ALL the time. I scour the area for signs, I look ALL OVER the place to make dang sure I am parked legally, because I can’t afford a ticket, nor can I afford the time to fight one.”
I once got a ticket parked directly under a sign that dais “No parking 7:00 am – 5:00 pm.” The ticket was written at 6:15 pm.
I once got a ticket for parking during street cleaning. The signs were posted on the north-south streets in the area. I was parked on an east west street with no sign.
Last year I got towed near Millenium Park. The tow was bogus for several reasons, including I was about 1/2 block from the address written on the ticket, and I couldn’t have possibly been at the address written, because…there was a huge pile of snow at that address that extended for about 4 car spaces. (I won the hearing and got my money back.) There were also a couple of signs that were twisted around, and literally facing perpindicular to the street, so it was impossible to tell where the no parking area was. When I got my car from the pound, the DOR employee actually said to me, as long as the signs are there, it doesn’t matter if they are twisted. It’s my responsibility to get out of the car and figure out which way the signs are suppose to be facing.
Wha…???
John…..remember…this is a discussion caused by a Traffic Aide with a quota and poor training
Not a PEA with poor training.
There you go Greg, he used the word “quota”.
DoR Employee Says:
John…..remember…this is a discussion caused by a Traffic Aide with a quota and poor training
===============================
WOW!! Really, are you a DOR employee and you just said that?!?? QUOTA?? I can’t tell you how many times I have been told there is NO QUOTA. Of course I DO NOT believe such, but it’s good to see an authority on the topic actually admit it. THANK YOU.
SouthLoop,
DoR pointed out that it the tickets were issued by a traffic control aide. Traffic Control Aides report to the OEMC.
Parking Enforcements Aides are Department of Revenue Employees. The Department of Revenue DOES NOT have a qouta. The “pressure” that ldypea is referring to, is our Supervisors following managements orders of making sure we are out of the office within 10-15 minutes after we start.
Ticketmaster,
The pressure that ldypea is referring to is not that they get out of the office, but that they ” get more …and more”. This can only mean tickets.
And we motorists don’t really care who works for whom, or who reports to whom, the 50.00 ticket still costs 50.00, and quotas are the wrong motivation for law enforcement.
Hey SouthLoop, methinks DoR Employee let the cat out of the bag.
Hey guys,
Let me try to shed some insight into the “quota” debate.
I feel this argument is more over semantics than anything.
From what I’ve learned over the past year or so is this.
There are no quotas in the strict definition of the word. At least on the Dept. of Revenue side when it comes to PEAs.
There does seem to be pressure from management to write tickets, but it’s seen more of a performance issue than trying to reach a certain number each day or week or month.
Now, if a PEA writes 1 ticket per day for an entire month, any rational person would question their performance. If a PEA obviously under performs, they would probably be fired.
The DOR seems to have put checks in place to discourage writing improper tickets. For example, if too many of a PEA’s tickets are contested and dismissed in Administrative Hearings, than this too would be considered a performance issue and could be grounds for dismissal.These performance metrics are measured and watched by management to try to make sure PEAs perform correctly.
That’s not to say I believe the DOR has eliminated all improper tickets, but I believe management sincerely tries to do this.
So, there are no magic number quotas each month, but the DOR does want PEAs writing as many proper tickets as possible.
To me, the debate over “quotas” is moot. It’s obvious the Mayor is looking to generate revenue wherever they can. If it means hiring more PEAs, or taking TMAs away from directing traffic and assigning them to parking enforcement, or increasing red light cameras, etc., etc., etc., who cares if there is or is not a quota. The bottom line is that enforcement is growing, and I as a motorist and citizen of the city, do not like this trend.
I would invite Ticketmaster, DoR and even Lady PEA to jump in here if they like to add or correct what I’ve said here.
PTG, I would say the reason that quotas are not moot is that quotas would be evidence of the motivation behind the ticket writing. As you said, it’s obviously about revenue, and not about “protecting citizens and upholding the law”.
Mere numbers are the wrong gauge to use to determine whether or not a PEA is doing a proper job. I’d like to see more hands on training of PEAs to instill them with knowledge and common sense on when to write a ticket and when not to. Obviously I’m not knowledgable on what their training consists of, but if mere numbers are the measuring stick as to whether or not a job is done well, then I can’t imagine that they are taught to use common sense.
You cited some examples which illustrate the extremes: 1 ticket a day for the month is obviously wrong, and too many contested and dismissed tickets may constitute a problem as well.
Somewhere in there is a balance; if that balance were to ever change in number and go down, I would hope that rather than assume that PEAs are not doing their job that instead the DOR would first investigate whether or not people were actually starting to comply with the laws, hence the lower number of tickets.
To me, it’s all about the motivation, and the law should not be a tool to raise revenue. The law is about protection and for the good of the citizens.
Do PEAs and the like take tests? Is there any certification to get the job? I’m just curious.
The “quota” thing is irrelevant. There’s still a clear and present predatory posture taken by the City (and it’s various parking enforcement entities) that has nothing to do with public safety and everything to do recessive taxing/fleecing.
I disagree with the media singling out one particular worker when you know damn well she’s taking her cues from a higher source and by no means the only “loose cannon”.
The real issue here is that fewer people are parking at meters, meter revenue is way down and yet ticket revenue is through the roof. Who needs a quota?
JA & Lance,
I think were on the same page, or at least close to the same page on this issue.
Lance, I heartily agree about picking on one city employee. At least with TMAs, it is certainly systematic as I just got photos of another TMA this morning writing expired meter tickets. How does that help ease traffic?
DoR,
Let’s work with the geek to answer the training question.
what gives……..tm……..dont want to include…..a….lady……..
When it comes to PEA training, here’s some Geek speculation on that subject.
Again, this is somewhat informed, but still speculation.
I think PEAs and booters all get some decent training. It’s not just a single 8 hour class. I believe it’s a week or two plus probationary status under the watchful eyes of veterans or supervisors. Trainees are on probation for a decent amount of time. During probation, they can easily be let go for performance issues.
I believe PEAs get more initial training than TMAs, SERCO and LAZ enforcement. And PEAs, from what I’ve seen, also have to get refreshers every once in a while on this or that violation, equipment, etc.
I think when it comes to parking violations, I think PEAs probably get more training in this particular area than police officers. Mainly because PEAs specialize in this area and cops have other issues (murder, robbery, drug dealers, etc.) to deal with.
So, it’s not like they take two hours of training, and then are shoved out the door with an AutoCite to ticket whatever cars may stumble into their path.
I would love to find out more. Seriously. If any of you PEAs care to share, I’m all ears, eyes, etc.
P.S. I don’t know why the DOR wouldn’t want to use this website as a forum to get more info about what they do, to the public.
If DOR management is listening in here, you write it, I’ll publish it. Simple as that.
Oh, a lot of what I just wrote is culled from recollections of e-mail exchanges from the one, the only, Ticketmaster.
Thanks TM.
I have to agree with you Geek that CPD and Tma sure do not get adequate training for ticket writing. This conclusion stems from me asking them about the tickets they write. I believe if you ask a PEA, Serco, CPD or Tma a question on a ordinance, that The PEA will be the only one to answer you. ( Most of the time)
I know for Fact……that PEA’s get better instruction into municipal code than the TMA’s that are writing tickets in the Loop Detail.
I was talking to a CTA supervisor a few days ago..she had a few questions about plate types and how to write them on the paper ticket books.
I asked her…didn’t they teach you this in training and get you a copy of the SOS plate type guide?
She looked astounded to know that there was material for reference…and Stated that she sat through 4 hours of Powerpoint and 30 minutes of hands on writing practice citations before they sent her on her merry way.
Once upon a time…TMA’s were Trained by the CPD at the Academy. I seem to remember it was 4 weeks of training or something like that. Now……TMA’s get 32 hours of training before they can tell cars what to do; and under 5 hours of training if given a ticket book and a badge. And what I just stated about training time for TMA’s is confirmed by a TMA I know that was in ticket school Summer of 08.
I was issued a Municipal Code Book when I started this job. And I actually annoy my bosses in requesting a new copy every year..so I can stay up to date.
The dumbass that is in the paper was writing anything that was parked at a sidewalk.
And Writing Street Cleaning after the end date.
I’d Fire the ditz…..and I know she is in my union.
TMA have a Monthly Average REQUIREMENT.
Before the Rolling 10 per day patrols started…..their daily quota was 5 per day……Average. I know a TMA Supervisor that flat out told me they have a daily quota. TJ somebody or other.
Now…Unsure what their current number is…..but it will not be lower.
And yes…..CPD and TMA have numbers they HAVE to do when told to write.
“TMA have a Monthly Average REQUIREMENT.
Before the Rolling 10 per day patrols started…..their daily quota was 5 per day……Average. I know a TMA Supervisor that flat out told me they have a daily quota. TJ somebody or other.
Now…Unsure what their current number is…..but it will not be lower.
And yes…..CPD and TMA have numbers they HAVE to do when told to write.”
So confirmation continues to finally roll in that there is in fact, a quota.
Greg-
Just to be clear, there may be quotas in place for TMA and CPD. I will take DoR’s word on this.
But prior debate on quotas was regarding PEAs and/or DOR. I don’t think there is, technically, a quota for tickets in the DOR.
PTG -
I understand.
But for the longest time we were hearing there are no quotas for tickets ANYWHERE in Chicago.
And though there may not be an actual quota in DOR, it has certainly been alluded to that there is pressure to write tickets.
Greg…..cmon.
There is pressure to produce in any and all jobs.
Department of Revenue PEA’s can Get away with issuing just 1 ticket a day.
They just HAVE to contact a supervisor every 30 minutes since they last issued a ticket to let the bosses know that they can’t find squat.
Yeah……Revenue has a Communication Requirement.
But no….Revenue does not have a Official Quota.
DoR said:
“There is pressure to produce in any and all jobs.”
This leads me back to the question/example I used earlier: Do fire departments have a certain number of fires they have to put out? After all, there is pressure to produce in this job, no? Would they be fired if they couldn’t find any fires to put out? Do they have to contact a supervisor to report that they aren’t finding any fires to put out? DOES PUTTING OUT FIRES BRING IN REVENUE?
That last question answers all the other questions.
And as far as I know, there aren’t any websites/blogs complaining about Chicago Firefighters, or the burden they impose on the citizens. I’m sure there are complaints and problems, but nothing that compares to the parking problems in this city.